DOM-MountainMan

[wndg]

https://www.sendspace.com/file/f94wtf
https://www.sendspace.com/file/f94wtf
https://www.sendspace.com/file/f94wtf
https://www.sendspace.com/file/f94wtf

[Hermione]

this looks like all of your other maps, except its placed in a jungle area

[Darkside]

[Sonic|^]

Why are there two kegs?

[wndg]

I figured it'd be hard to stay alive with the amp on this map, it's small. A few maps have keg amps, Peak, Slimetime. You can't pick em up without a boost and I think certain styled maps warrant a little cushion for the amp-er.

[Sauron]

[Darkside]

[wndg]

[HUMPTY]

Is uploaded onto ip3,5,6 happy fraggin

[wndg]

Touched up the terrain, less buggy. Removed the gallery point. Added a different cp. Moved the belt. Limited the amount of doors and pathways around the map. Hopefully it'll flow as opposed to leak. Moved the falls cp up a level as well.
beta2

https://www.mediafire.com/?dd87dee6sutwge6
https://www.mediafire.com/?dd87dee6sutwge6
https://www.mediafire.com/?dd87dee6sutwge6
https://www.mediafire.com/?dd87dee6sutwge6

no texture pack changes

thanks to everyone that played the first version.

[wndg]

Stock intro ship underneath khxmz ninja intro ship that you'll never see in game but it's there, doing something.



The control points weren't showing up during online play in beta2, but I see them fine in offline mode. Khxms seemingly added these ninja decorations near every control point in the LE14 sdom maps. Ninja intro dude, intro ship, intro boss. Hoping the voodoo will work for loveshackbeta3



Tweaked lighting. Tweaked barn point ever so slightly. Hopefully the control points will show in the hud in online play.


https://www.mediafire.com/?xwi6m9hkg0s51kl
https://www.mediafire.com/?xwi6m9hkg0s51kl

If beta2(or the first beta) is on the server this is being uploaded to you don't need to add the texture package included in the .rar.

[Monk]

Those boss ship things were added for casting ease I believe so you could bind travelling to a certain cp

[PACO]

Monk is indeed correct.

[wndg]

recorded some podcast in the background by mistake, mute video.

Doesn't really look too shack-ish anymore.


https://www.mediafire.com/?fh3b23oydydes5d
https://www.mediafire.com/?fh3b23oydydes5d


i hope the UTtech4 is on redirect, it's a stock patch texture package. There's no more custom textures.

[Xenoscythe]

I think UTtech4 was a tac ops stock package not ut99 so it's probably not on the redirect yet, I'll poke paco. the map is however uploaded onto the server

[wndg]

I thought that texture package was in one of the bonus packs epic released. Don't think they ever had anything to do with tac ops. Doesn't matter though.



https://www.mediafire.com/?vmavc2iq2q99z0z

Added some lights near the gallery point, no more hiding in the shadows. Some minor texture changes and touching up.

I thought about moving the thigh pads, but decided not too. Could make retaking the sight easier on the attacker, maybe make getting boosted down less of a death sentence. As it stands now those pads are just for those of us trying to get a little stack on the way to the gallery.

[ulo]

I will look more into this map when I get home to my desktop computer (around 3-4th Jan).

It's not that I don't care for the map or the effort, but I can't even make simple elevator jumps on the laptop so looking through maps I don't have any previous experience of is really hard and I rather wait and give some proper feedback.

Keep up the good work!

[Hermione]

Played this map yesterday, the spawns are okay, the problem is the map is to confusing to find where your spot is because everything looks the same, overall it was not a fun experience, 2/10. Good effort though, the textures are easy on the eyes also.

[RickJames]

I actually wrote a detailed post with the problems I saw while pugging this map, but the forums logged me out half-way and it's lost

So I'll try to summarize it:

In general, the bath and falls cps on this map play like 3v3 shock TDM. It's frag-heavy, clusterfucky, and rather idom-like. This is because of a few general problems:

- Most of the outside area is used for spawning and a couple random pickups, but often you get multiple players spawning out there and shooting at each other, forcing you to fight them to be able to start getting to your point. This contributes to the map's fragpower-biased flow.
- Bath has one main funnel-entrance up a ramp. There are other ways of getting to the point, but spawns funnel most traffic through here. This makes the point very, very easy to hold, as you can just stand/crouch in place and cover this spot. Not to mention that most of the time the enemies will only need 1 shot. The whole cp reminds me a bit of corner on Cinder, except the enemies spawn farther away (giving you more time to stack before going back to shooting the funnel ramp) and there's an amp that makes it a dedicated 2 person spot.
- Going to bath off of most spawns, you pass by or are visible to the falls player. The 2 cps are fairly close. You often get a shot from this guy on the way to bath, or you get a shot at him. Sure, it doesn't happen if your team controls falls, but it's just not good to have a cp that is this easy to push off of or this close to a cp with one main path.
- Because of the 2 previous problems, bath is insanely easy to hold with an amp. This is the biggest problem with bath, it's easier with amp than any other cp on any map. It's easy to hold without an amp, but with an amp you can comfortably shoot the aforementioned funnel-like ramp all day and drop on belt and armors after killing the enemies with little risk. You can also kill the falls guy on the way, but bath is so easy to hold by itself that it's not all that necessary.

As some evidence, here are stats for the last 2 mountainman games:
http://www.ownedwell.com/utstats/?p=match&mid=9705
http://www.ownedwell.com/utstats/?p=match&mid=9739
Note the amp graphs: extreme positive points on all amp runs. This is because you don't have to spend much time stacking with amp, you just have to sit on the point and take the belts freely when you can. On no other map do you commonly see +30 net points on multiple runs in one map, unless teams are very bad.

It reminds me of sdom-malice, having to 4-shot double kill 2 players right after I've spawned sometimes just to get on the path to bath. Also, powerups have relatively little importance except for the amped player, since you often get 5-shot not long after picking up belt. But on mountainman, an amp is insanely powerful at bath. There are many good sdom maps where amp runs are very powerful, but this takes it to an extreme. It seems that the effort in dedicating even 3 players to killing a stacked amped player sitting at bath can be futile long enough that it hurts as much as it helps.

I try to keep an open mind and give good suggestions, but I'm not sure what to suggest here. Honestly, I think there are other maps with much more potential, sorry wndg.

[csnafk]

Solid post RJ, that's the kind of feedback that makes things happen.

I haven't been able to play Bath yet, but looking at the graph it does seem that amp runs are heading in an extremely overpowered direction. On my time playing Falls vs wndg I did notice that wndg was in the middle area a lot trying to pop a shot or two onto the enemy team. Since the spawns do have a slight tendency to funnel into mid this makes controlling Bath easier while you suffer minimal risk of losing your point because the spawns push toward mid. Although risky to put yourself out there of course, there isn't anywhere else really that more important to stand since, as mentioned before, the spawns have a tendency to push players through mid a majority of the time. I'm certain with simple spawn altercations and a little bit of changes to Bath the map can be sufficient for league level.

[Junkyardboy]

basing an argument based off stats alone are a bad way to judge the map.

The stats are very much not accurate. Just because during an amp run, the team went up +30 point, doesn't necessarily mean that it was because of the amp. It simply could have been because the other two points coincidentally started playing better and helped racked up more points during the amp run.

The map is still new and it has not been played enough times to learn ways to counter the amp. The two stats you posted were from Cromaniac and myself(who arguably have the most experience on that map) vs. players with little to no experience on the map.

There's been some massive swings with amp runs and dual amp runs on many maps when the teams are off or the other team is just simply clueless. I've seen sdom-curse amp runs that last the entire game or dual amps. I've seen dual amps on olden and campgrounds and even peak, but we never changed a single thing on the map.

I believe it's statistically true for virtually all maps that amp runs always last longer when you are playing the map for the first time.

There are so many factors that you would have to key in before you can call the amp too over powered.

When slimetime first came out, how many players were able to run around and go godlike every amp run? It's now one of the more popular sdom maps that we have on our maplist. Players are are also more comfortable and know the map better, longer amp runs don't happen as easy which I predict to happen with mountainman.

Having said all that, I am not calling mountainman a perfect sdom map as there are potential for some tweaks to be made, but to call the amp over powered and calling bathouse a dumb point is silly. The statement you are making that you can hold the controlpoints too easy is the very reason those points are very much suitable for sdom. The shittiest sdom points are the ones that are tagged back and forth with ease and give the map a simple DOM/TDM feel. The points that are easier to control are points that are the most fun to play and give the map an sdom feel. It also increased the skill ceiling big time and makes it somehwhat unforgiving.

no one has said anything about statues and you put a good player up against an inexperienced player on statues, guaranteed you are going to have 50-100 dom point swings on that point(w/o even an amp or any powerups)


me and tempus vs. pete and windigo:
http://www.ownedwell.com/utstats/?p=match&mid=9701
very balanced and close game. I believe it was tempus' first time playing.

[wndg]

[Sauron]

Amp is fairly easy to kill quickly with decent teamwork. You are literally falling midair to get the amp. All it takes is 2 guys waiting for the drop and the amp is dead before they hit the ground or shortly after. Since there has only been 8 pugs in the map, the teamwork isn't great so far and is rather up and down, but as people learn the map, the amp will become naturally less effective.

[clankiller]

to be fair windy i moved to bath after paleface with cro had had enough of it with you and jyb. +35 with amp doesnt happen on other maps much at all even with me on the other team and even i got over a rampage with amp at bath... i also hit jyb 5x in a row and the bitch still had time to wait about scratching his ass to re-stack without our team closing on him...

CK...

[Hermione]

[miracle]

Hey, I was the only monsterkill on ricochet, get ur facts straight windigo

[wndg]

Think I addressed all the issues fairly well. I thought it was pretty decent before but now even better.


http://www.mediafire.com/download/yhwv4 ... -beta2.rar

http://www.mediafire.com/download/vmavc ... eLE14a.rar

http://www.mediafire.com/download/mu3eb ... Ttech4.rar

thanks to everyone that play tested the map

thanks to everyone that's given me constructive criticism

[csnafk]

After running around with wndbro/Gizmo I seriously can't wait to pug this map. It's been opened way up

[clankiller]

like the jump pad behind bath now wndg.

CK.

[wndg]

I think it's really shaping up nicely. Gizmo found a way to solo the amp, so I fixed that shit. Took the opportunity to polish up the barn position.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/u3uvx ... -beta3.rar

slimetime le14a isn't on the servers, it's nearly identical just some lighting and texture touch ups. slimewall near the gallery point slightly bigger due to being borderless.